NPM’s liturgical song survey…memed!
Participate in the survey. You need not be a member of NPM to partake.
They will be publishing a list of the most popular and most important liturgical songs later in the year, based on survey responses. Given that many responses will not see the light of day, this survey might be more enlightening if it became a meme.
So what did I contribute?
- My choice for a liturgical song that makes a difference: Credo VI
- Composer, text writer, hymnal, and/or other source: Graduale Romanum, Gregorian Missal for Sundays, Liber Usualis, etc.
- Please tell us the reasons for your selection: It’s the Creed; it’s in Latin; it’s challenging to learn; when sung well, it’s the most festive chanted profession of faith we have; it’s modal; and once learned, it’s never forgotten.
- Comments: It probably won’t make the “most popular” list, but no liturgical song is more important and more neglected than the Creed.
- Tag five people: I want this thing to explode, so if you’ve read this and have a ‘blog of your own, consider yourself tagged.
Should you participate in the meme, please e-mail me at homepage at cantemusdomino dot net with your link so I can highlight your response here. Don’t neglect sending your response to NPM either.
Stay tuned for an MP3 of Credo VI.
Update: Here’s the promised MP3 (1.20MB, 56KBps, 3:00)
Update: Courtesy of the St. Cecilia Schola Cantorum, here’s a PDF of Credo VI.
[Via Mary Jane Ballou.]
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16 Comments
Credo VI is way groovy indeed.
I opted for the Dupre Ave Verum Corpus. Running a close second is the Messiaen O Sacrum Convivium, and a pretty close third, the C.V. Stanford “O For a Closer Walk with God”. In a tie with the Stanford is the Faure Cantique de Jean Racine.
JP
Again, thanks, AAE, for providing an interesting item.
My choice was the Paschal Exapostilarion, or the Hymn of Light from the Russian Orthodox Service of Paschal Matins, in the setting made by Alexander Glazunov.
My reason for doing so was that Pascha, or the Resurrection of Christ, is the center of our Christian life. At the center of Paschal Matins is the Exapostilarion, or Hymn of Light. The most beautiful setting that I have ever heard of it was by Alexander Glazunov. Pdf and midi files of a setting in English for SATB (originally male choir) may be found at http://www.podoben.com, and more particularly, here:
http://www.podoben.com/PDF%20FILES/Pascha%20Mixed%20PDF/Paschal%20Exaposilarion%20-%20Glazunov.pdf
The text in English is as follows:
In the flesh didst Thou fall asleep, as a mortal man, O King and Lord. Thou didst rise on the third day, raising Adam from corruption, and destroying death. O Pascha of Incorruption: the salvation of our souls.
As someone who is not overly familiar with a lot of these settings and/or chants, may I make a suggestion…
That you all agree on a single piece (or at least two pieces), and that you would vote on it.
Forgive my cynicism, but I would think that single votes would not be taken seriously, in any medium. But if a hundred votes go towards Credo VI, or Tantum Ergo or Pange Lingua, then you will have their attention.
Nick
I understand the cynicism, which is one of the reasons why I turned it into a meme. If the meme is traced through the sites, we could find some interesting selections.
Actually, it is my expectation that even if they did get a fair number of votes for the aforementioned chants and hymns, they would neglect it. But I’m willing to be surprised. -AAE
Well, who knows how this poll thing is set up over at NPM. If I might be equally as cynical, the thought has occured to me that perhaps NPM have already made up their minds who will get these votes, and that this online thing is simply the equivalent of a light switch mounted on the wall to which no wiring is attached — You flick it on and off as much as you want, but nothing really happens. I hope I’m wrong, though….
JP
Aristotle,
How does singing the creed in latin ‘make a difference’? Please do not interpret this as cynicism, but isn’t it important that the overwhelming majority of the faithful, who don’t know latin, actually KNOW what they are professing? The chant is beautiful, yes, but this is the post-Vatican II Roman Catholic Church.
David, after 25 YEARS of reciting the Creed in English, how can you POSSIBLY state that [using Latin means that] the Faithful do not understand the text?
Heh.
I gave them the Dies Irae. At my age, it’s worth knowing and remembering.
Dad29…good call…you beat me to that very same response. I’ve never quite understood the rationale behind anybody saying “I don’t understand the Mass in Latin”…as if, when celebrated in Latin, the whole Mass becomes this secret “other animal” much different from the English translation. Having recently (actually like several months ago) the drafts of the new translations of the ritual texts for our diocesan committee of priests, it became clear just how hit-and-miss our current English version is. If we should have any beef with texts, it should be with our current English script. The old story about the schoolboy who translated his Caesar assignment as “and the valient general charged naked up the hill with his sword” is really a good description of what we have now. By the way, the actual translation of that famous line is “the valient general charged up the hill with his sword drawn” (gladio nudo, as opposed to nudus cum gladio). In short, what we have is more or less the Berlitz version of the Roman Canon.
JP
Sorry…i forgot the participle in a sentence above (mea minima culpa). That sentence should have read “Having recently reviewed”.
JP
I suggested the Exultet for being a clear, true, beautiful and timeless statement of the Church’s work of praise throughout the millenia.
My survey entry was also Dies irae. For its clear-eyed facing of death and for seeking death’s remedy, the salvation and mercy wrought by Christ. It was very much part of my personal prayer for several weeks after 9/11.
The comments about whether people ‘understand’ Mass parts in Latin remind me of a co-worker who left the Church in the 60’s. He once told me: “They changed the Mass from Latin and I didn’t understand a word they were saying anymore.” Point being that with the Latin, everyone knew that effort was needed to teach the real meaning of what was being done in the liturgy. Sometimes I think with Mass in English, we hear familiar words and assume that everything is clear. But reall, explanation is needed.
Mine was the chant setting of “Ubi caritas …” with a highlight on Durufle’s arrangement.
I also warned them of the limited utility, from a statistical standpoint, of this poll. It is not a reliable sample of the church music community — though a similar poll of AGO members in Catholic churches would be even less representative of all musicians — and so they cannot infer that the church music community thinks or believes anything based on the data. All they have, I told them, was a collection of stories.
Dad29,
I minister in a large parish with many young families attending mass. While you may have been reciting the creed for 25 years, half of the people at my Sunday evening mass haven’t even been alive that long. How can you possibly make a statement like that? Regarding Jason’s comments about not understanding the mass in latin, those of us that attend more than 1 mass a weekend (in my case, seven) have no problem. My sister and her 5 kids will not know what their own prayer means. Honestly, how many people know latin?? Is it just me-am I missing something?? I love latin. I studied it in high school and college. But there is a reason most congregations around the world celebrate mass in the vernacular. I refuse to believe it’s because they’re lazy. The mass is no less glorious for me in english, and i hope and pray that is the case for you. Otherwise you’re missing the forest for the trees, and treading very close to the example of the Pharisees that we ought not follow.
Pharisaical? Frankly, my blogsite self-description is “nasty.” (And proud of it…)
It’s my estimation that each member of your parish has spoken the Creed in English at least once/week for a minimum average of 7 years.
If you wish to maintain that they are still ignorant of the text, that’s up to you. You certainly know them better than I do.
As to the whole “controversy” over Latin vs. English–does your parish church have stained-glass windows? Does the organist use Dupre or Langlais voluntaries? Are there Stations of the Cross?
If so, someone recognizes the value of transcendence, or the “uncommon” which lends clarity midst mystery. Latin is properly a “sacred language,” which like “sacred place, sacred time” lends to the verticality of the Mass.
Do you understand precisely (I mean precisely) the reason that D major ‘moves the soul’ differently than C major? Can you explain this difference in English, or any other language?
If not, then why your insistence on the pragmatism of vernacular?
I make no case for All Latin All The Time. But those who insist otherwise display a vision which is narrow, indeed.
(The above is NOT a Pharisaical comment. It is nasty.)
For the record:
Does anyone here agree that Credo VI (as well as Credo I, Credo II, Credo V, and all others based more or less on the same model) is a very boring piece of music? I suppose it is better than the major-mode, 17th century Credo III (in the corrupt style of Abbot DuMont), but I can still say this: we did Credo VI all through Lent, and even with a nice organ accompaniment, I was SO glad when Lent was over: Credo VI (et al) are just so repetitious! At least to me.
I do like Credo IV, though.
Best,
JMO
Dad29,
I recognize the value of the uncommon, the transcendent and the etherial. We sing in latin in my parish. The difference is, stained-glass, stations of the cross and Dupre, do not need translation to be understood and appreciated. Latin does, especially a long text like the creed (as opposed to the agnus dei). I believe latin is a means to an end, and is no more ’sacred’ than any other language. It is more traditional, yes, but more sacred? Are you saying that people are drawn closer to God when they sing in latin than when they sing in english, or french, or slovenian? The organ, likewise, is a means to an end, no more sacred, I’m sorry, than a guitar. This website is devoted to traditionalists, and that’s fine. But beauty comes in many sizes, shapes, genres and languages, not just the few you grew up with. It’s a shame that people can’t appreciate both the new and the old, as ministers are called to draw from both. Personally, I pray equally well whether the mass is sung in predominantly latin or if it is a lifeteen mass (which is approved by the vatican…hmm) because Christ is the center of my attention as well as his body that surrounds me in my brothers and sisters in the church. The Holy Spirit still inspires composers today as was the case centuries ago. Don’t discard the gifts of the Spirit that surround you today, my friend.








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